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What do you consider to be true romantic love?

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Which of these two alternatives do you find describes romantic true love the best?
(1) Loving someone because you need them. ("I love you because I need you!") 18%  18%  [ 7 ]
(2) Needing someone because you love them. ("I need you because I love you!") 82%  82%  [ 31 ]
Total votes : 38

qawer
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01 Apr 2013, 5:01 pm

Janissy wrote:
As opposed to what? Not wanting them? You have a very peculiar notion of romantic love if it doesn't include wanting.


I'm not saying true love does not include wanting.

The question is whether you romantically love a person because you want them, or want them because you love them.

Or differently stated: is true love stronger than animalistic needs. Is there more to true love than animalistic needs/wants? If you only "truly love" someone because you need/want them, there really is not more to true love than animalistic needs/wants, right?



BlueMax
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01 Apr 2013, 5:10 pm

MjrMajorMajor wrote:
qawer wrote:
MjrMajorMajor wrote:
Why does there have to be an element of need to love someone? I've always thought of the entire "I can't live without this person" to be either an exaggeration, or seriously problematic.


Some people might stop "truly loving" another person if that person could no longer give them what they need.


Then it wasn't love in the first place, if there was just a mad grab for fulfillment. I didn't vote because I find both answers invalid.


Now I wish I'd done the same instead of picking #2 as the closest option of the two.



qawer
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01 Apr 2013, 5:12 pm

BlueMax wrote:
Now I wish I'd done the same instead of picking #2 as the closest option of the two.


You did the right thing my friend. That's why I formulated the poll question as "the best". :wink:



qawer
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01 Apr 2013, 5:24 pm

At this point 81% (of 27 votes) has voted 2.

My guess is, in the general population, number 1 would get more votes that number 2. But obviously, that remains a guess.



BlueMax
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01 Apr 2013, 5:29 pm

More likely, the general population is doing #1, but would choose #2 as "the correct answer".

Most people know what's right & wrong - many choose to act in self-interest anyway.



qawer
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01 Apr 2013, 5:34 pm

BlueMax wrote:
More likely, the general population is doing #1, but would choose #2 as "the correct answer".

Most people know what's right & wrong - many choose to act in self-interest anyway.


You get me. This is the essence of the poll.

If there was such a thing as true love, would people not act to achieve it? At the end of the day it is not of first priority in a relationship - survival is the true first priority in a relationship.

But if one thinks of the desire to survive as "true love", then true love is a first priority.



Janissy
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01 Apr 2013, 5:48 pm

qawer wrote:
BlueMax wrote:
More likely, the general population is doing #1, but would choose #2 as "the correct answer".

Most people know what's right & wrong - many choose to act in self-interest anyway.


You get me. This is the essence of the poll.

If there was such a thing as true love, would people not act to achieve it? At the end of the day it is not of first priority in a relationship - survival is the true first priority in a relationship.

But if one thinks of the desire to survive as "true love", then true love is a first priority.


Your concept of "true love" sounds so abstract as to not be applicable between two actual people. One person who is not actually in any sort of relationship with another person might convince themselves that they have "true love" for the person they are not actually with. But the actuality between two people is much messier and earthier than this abstract notion that occurs in a vacuum.



qawer
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01 Apr 2013, 5:58 pm

Janissy wrote:
qawer wrote:
BlueMax wrote:
More likely, the general population is doing #1, but would choose #2 as "the correct answer".

Most people know what's right & wrong - many choose to act in self-interest anyway.


You get me. This is the essence of the poll.

If there was such a thing as true love, would people not act to achieve it? At the end of the day it is not of first priority in a relationship - survival is the true first priority in a relationship.

But if one thinks of the desire to survive as "true love", then true love is a first priority.


Your concept of "true love" sounds so abstract as to not be applicable between two actual people. One person who is not actually in any sort of relationship with another person might convince themselves that they have "true love" for the person they are not actually with. But the actuality between two people is much messier and earthier than this abstract notion that occurs in a vacuum.


I agree.

Hence, there is no such thing as true love, unless you consider your love for someone rooted in your own desire to survive to be true love. It's only fooling yourself to think otherwise.

People should not fool themselves thinking there is more to love than their own desire to survive. Well, they should in order to stay together, but in reality there really is not more to "true love" than survival-desires.

It's not a problem, only a matter of accepting it :wink:



Janissy
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01 Apr 2013, 6:05 pm

qawer wrote:
Janissy wrote:
qawer wrote:
BlueMax wrote:
More likely, the general population is doing #1, but would choose #2 as "the correct answer".

Most people know what's right & wrong - many choose to act in self-interest anyway.


You get me. This is the essence of the poll.

If there was such a thing as true love, would people not act to achieve it? At the end of the day it is not of first priority in a relationship - survival is the true first priority in a relationship.

But if one thinks of the desire to survive as "true love", then true love is a first priority.


Your concept of "true love" sounds so abstract as to not be applicable between two actual people. One person who is not actually in any sort of relationship with another person might convince themselves that they have "true love" for the person they are not actually with. But the actuality between two people is much messier and earthier than this abstract notion that occurs in a vacuum.


I agree.

Hence, there is no such thing as true love, unless you consider your love for someone rooted in your own desire to survive to be true love. It's only fooling yourself to think otherwise.

People should not fool themselves thinking there is more to love than their own desire to survive. Well, they should in order to stay together, but in reality there really is not more to "true love" than survival-desires.

It's not a problem, only a matter of accepting it :wink:


I don't know where you get these ideas but these ideas have nothing to do with how real humans love each other.



qawer
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01 Apr 2013, 6:09 pm

Janissy wrote:
I don't know where you get these ideas but these ideas have nothing to do with how real humans love each other.


It's just the truth in a "cosmic sense". If you look at how things actually work out.

"Between humans" there is lots of true love. It's because humans convert the "objective truth" into a "subjective truth".

Viewed scientifically true love does not exist.

Viewed "between humans" true love does exist, because we convert our survival into being "a purpose with more purpose than to survive".

So the poll really reflects whether people view the world scientifically or "between humans". Aspies are (I think!) more likely to view the world scientifically.



Last edited by qawer on 01 Apr 2013, 6:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

BlueMax
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01 Apr 2013, 6:16 pm

Some people can't move beyond self-interest. They just can't.

I feel sorry for them... and they can't stand "starry-eyed idealists" like me. I guess we'll never see eye-to-eye there...



qawer
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01 Apr 2013, 6:19 pm

BlueMax wrote:
Some people can't move beyond self-interest. They just can't.

I feel sorry for them... and they can't stand "starry-eyed idealists" like me. I guess we'll never see eye-to-eye there...


It's a matter of whether you view the world scientifically/"in a cosmic sense" or "between humans".

That's why it's so difficult for aspie people and "NT"-people to understand each other. The first view the world "in a cosmic sense", the last "between humans".



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02 Apr 2013, 2:05 am

qawer wrote:
BlueMax wrote:
Some people can't move beyond self-interest. They just can't.

I feel sorry for them... and they can't stand "starry-eyed idealists" like me. I guess we'll never see eye-to-eye there...


It's a matter of whether you view the world scientifically/"in a cosmic sense" or "between humans".

That's why it's so difficult for aspie people and "NT"-people to understand each other. The first view the world "in a cosmic sense", the last "between humans".

but you don't even know how NTs view this issue because you are putting words in their mouths.


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Wolfheart
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02 Apr 2013, 3:25 am

BlueMax wrote:
Some people can't move beyond self-interest. They just can't.

I feel sorry for them... and they can't stand "starry-eyed idealists" like me. I guess we'll never see eye-to-eye there...


A spiritual type of selfless love, God's love because other types of love may be done for vain pursuits or gain so the purest form of love. I think love should be love should be selfless and both people should truly care for one another but this is a very rare form of love.



qawer
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02 Apr 2013, 6:25 am

hyperlexian wrote:
qawer wrote:
BlueMax wrote:
Some people can't move beyond self-interest. They just can't.

I feel sorry for them... and they can't stand "starry-eyed idealists" like me. I guess we'll never see eye-to-eye there...


It's a matter of whether you view the world scientifically/"in a cosmic sense" or "between humans".

That's why it's so difficult for aspie people and "NT"-people to understand each other. The first view the world "in a cosmic sense", the last "between humans".

but you don't even know how NTs view this issue because you are putting words in their mouths.


You are right. It's not always a problem. But I think this forum holds enough evidence to say that it often is. The brains are fundamentally differently wired.



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02 Apr 2013, 6:40 am

qawer wrote:
Which of these two alternatives do you find describes true romantic love the best? (i.e. with sexual attraction etc., not true love to family members, friends etc.)

(1) Loving someone because you need them. ("I love you because I need you!") (NT "true love")

(2) Needing someone because you love them. ("I need you because I love you!") (Aspie "true love")


neither of those alternatives apply to me. i love someone because they are who they are, and i like who they are.

"need" is not an ingredient involved in the matter. you present 2 opposing alternatives that are founded on the notion of "need". i need nothing but air and food and water and shelter. i did not vote.