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Ganondox
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09 Nov 2016, 2:19 am

johnnyh wrote:
A question we need to ask is what eugenics is:killing off undesirables? Preventing the disease through editing?

We also need to ask whether or not autism is a disorder. Would an autistic person be able to survive in ancient times? The evidence for autism not being entirely inheritable but also being more likely to happen due to pollution and other negative factors like disease in a parent or so on is becoming firmer. Would removing toxins or chemicals from the environment be eugenics if it denies the chance an individual develops the disorder be genocide? How do you all reconcile that?

Another disruption would be the fact evidence is pointing to autism having a pathology in the brain rather than a different brain being born. It is not a Linux to a windows then, it is a windows with something added in.

I leave with this article:
http://www.npr.org/sections/health-shot ... izophrenia

Just because it exists doesn't make it somehow meant to be. There are numerous accidents in evolution, some are from added complexity making more room for error. If you ask "why does it still exist if it is not beneficial or a gift?". Then there is an answer. Few scientists would be stumped by that question.

You all can disagree if you want, but at least accept and own some of the above is true, or dispute it if you don't think it is.


Autism is by definition a disorder. However, just because something is a disorder doesn't mean it's inherently bad, and it can actually be of huge advantage to the society. Also, the question needs to come is the disorder inherent to the neurology of the person, or is it the result of the way it interacts with society? Disability is ultimately a social construct because evolution doesn't give a damn. There is no right or wrong, only what survives and what doesn't. But just because something ends up dying out doesn't mean it was inferior either, it just means it couldn't survive in the enviroment it was in. The question of whether someone with autism could live in ancient times is completely irrevelant, as we don't live in ancient times. We are a part of nature, and it changes as we change. The question we actually need to ask is 1. can autistic people survive if society supports them and 2. are autistic people valuable for being autistic? For at least some people on the spectrum, the clear answer is "yes" to both points.

If it's not something that's inheritable, it's not covered by eugenics. Eugenics is only considered with bringing about desirable genes. Anyway, there is NO evidence that autism is the result of toxins. What we actually have is evidence that autism isn't entirely genetic (which does NOT mean it's caused by a toxin), and some sketchy correlational studies which have connected autism to just about everything. Further analysis shows what is most likely going on is that toxins can cause mental retardation, and when mental retardation is comorbid with autism an actual diagnosis of autism is signficantly more likely.

Your last point makes absolutely no sense from the perspective of someone who actually understands how mental disorders work.


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Bushmaster
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13 Nov 2016, 12:24 pm

there are individuals in society who can't sleep a night without somehow plotting the downfall or utter extermination of those who oppose the notion of conformity all the while they lie to humanity by arguing that such lack of regard for life is for the greater good of the gene pool.

in other words they want to do what the NWO is already doing by enslaving humanity into a perilous orgy of blind obedience along with rigid conformity on steroids.


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johnnyh
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20 Nov 2016, 9:47 pm

If autism is supposedly 100% genetic, then why are there identical twin pairs where one isn't autistic? The epigenome which is susceptible to environmental influence is responsible according to the best science.

The triple hit hypothesis is looking to be a theory.


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I want to apologize to the entire forum. I have been a terrible person, very harsh and critical.
I still hold many of my views, but I will tone down my anger and stop being so bigoted and judgmental. I can't possibly know how you see things and will stop thinking I know everything you all think.

-Johnnyh


Ganondox
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21 Nov 2016, 1:27 am

johnnyh wrote:
If autism is supposedly 100% genetic, then why are there identical twin pairs where one isn't autistic? The epigenome which is susceptible to environmental influence is responsible according to the best science.

The triple hit hypothesis is looking to be a theory.


Who said autism is 100% genetic? I specifically stated that we have "evidence that autism isn't entirely genetic". The problem is you don't understand what not being 100% genetic actually implies, thinking it means that there must be toxin involved or something.


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johnnyh
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25 Nov 2016, 4:25 am

Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
If autism is supposedly 100% genetic, then why are there identical twin pairs where one isn't autistic? The epigenome which is susceptible to environmental influence is responsible according to the best science.

The triple hit hypothesis is looking to be a theory.


Who said autism is 100% genetic? I specifically stated that we have "evidence that autism isn't entirely genetic". The problem is you don't understand what not being 100% genetic actually implies, thinking it means that there must be toxin involved or something.


The epigenome can be affected by outside factors. What factors do you think they are?


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I want to apologize to the entire forum. I have been a terrible person, very harsh and critical.
I still hold many of my views, but I will tone down my anger and stop being so bigoted and judgmental. I can't possibly know how you see things and will stop thinking I know everything you all think.

-Johnnyh


Ganondox
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26 Nov 2016, 11:29 pm

johnnyh wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
If autism is supposedly 100% genetic, then why are there identical twin pairs where one isn't autistic? The epigenome which is susceptible to environmental influence is responsible according to the best science.

The triple hit hypothesis is looking to be a theory.


Who said autism is 100% genetic? I specifically stated that we have "evidence that autism isn't entirely genetic". The problem is you don't understand what not being 100% genetic actually implies, thinking it means that there must be toxin involved or something.


The epigenome can be affected by outside factors. What factors do you think they are?


First, the epigenome doesn't even need to get involved to explain it. Second, I actually think they're mainly social factors, not biological ones. When it is biologically, it's probably not that it causes autism, but that it causes mental retardation which in turn makes the autism more likely to be diagnosed.


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27 Nov 2016, 12:50 am

Such as stress or anxiety during pregnancy?


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I want to apologize to the entire forum. I have been a terrible person, very harsh and critical.
I still hold many of my views, but I will tone down my anger and stop being so bigoted and judgmental. I can't possibly know how you see things and will stop thinking I know everything you all think.

-Johnnyh


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27 Nov 2016, 3:24 am

johnnyh wrote:
Such as stress or anxiety during pregnancy?


No, I mean social factors after birth. Stress and anxiety during pregnancy results in biological factors.


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saffron
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27 Nov 2016, 3:28 am

I agree rats_and_cats. I have an alternative argument for why eugenics is BS (at this point in human history) but I am a bit too exhausted to have people argue at me.


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27 Nov 2016, 10:08 am

Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
Such as stress or anxiety during pregnancy?


No, I mean social factors after birth. Stress and anxiety during pregnancy results in biological factors.


Why is there a 50/50 chance of autism from Fragile X? It is obviously increased in chances from a syndrome.


_________________
I want to apologize to the entire forum. I have been a terrible person, very harsh and critical.
I still hold many of my views, but I will tone down my anger and stop being so bigoted and judgmental. I can't possibly know how you see things and will stop thinking I know everything you all think.

-Johnnyh


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28 Nov 2016, 5:11 am

johnnyh wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
Such as stress or anxiety during pregnancy?


No, I mean social factors after birth. Stress and anxiety during pregnancy results in biological factors.


Why is there a 50/50 chance of autism from Fragile X? It is obviously increased in chances from a syndrome.


Fragile X is a genetic disorder, so I don't see what your point is.


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johnnyh
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29 Nov 2016, 3:31 pm

Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
Such as stress or anxiety during pregnancy?


No, I mean social factors after birth. Stress and anxiety during pregnancy results in biological factors.


Why is there a 50/50 chance of autism from Fragile X? It is obviously increased in chances from a syndrome.


Fragile X is a genetic disorder, so I don't see what your point is.


So what are the enviromental factors that cause one twin to be neurotypical but another to be autistic?


_________________
I want to apologize to the entire forum. I have been a terrible person, very harsh and critical.
I still hold many of my views, but I will tone down my anger and stop being so bigoted and judgmental. I can't possibly know how you see things and will stop thinking I know everything you all think.

-Johnnyh


johnnyh
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30 Nov 2016, 6:02 pm

You aren't replying?

May I remind you that you are supposed to look at the evidence and draw a conclusion. This means coming to the conclusion that autism is not a disease therefore the causes cannot have any environmental role and is 100% genetic is not correct, that comorbidities only increase the chances of getting diagnosed and are not resulting from autism, the environmental factors, or the genes is incorrect, that there has been no slight increase in diagnosis since it must be entirely genetic is incorrect.

The non-autistic twin often has a disorder or learning disability. The gene(s) cause them but the result is different due to an absence or presence of dna methylation factors. What factors could affect dna methylation to the very core? Do you honestly think it is random pure chance? Not even people say these things for schizophrenia or bipolar.


_________________
I want to apologize to the entire forum. I have been a terrible person, very harsh and critical.
I still hold many of my views, but I will tone down my anger and stop being so bigoted and judgmental. I can't possibly know how you see things and will stop thinking I know everything you all think.

-Johnnyh


johnnyh
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30 Nov 2016, 6:05 pm

Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
Such as stress or anxiety during pregnancy?


No, I mean social factors after birth. Stress and anxiety during pregnancy results in biological factors.


Why is there a 50/50 chance of autism from Fragile X? It is obviously increased in chances from a syndrome.


Fragile X is a genetic disorder, so I don't see what your point is.


If a genetic disorder that causes suffering increases the chance of autism, doesn't that make autism a disease?
Why isn't autism, which is supposedly so good and not a disorder, not caused by healthy eating or exercise then?


_________________
I want to apologize to the entire forum. I have been a terrible person, very harsh and critical.
I still hold many of my views, but I will tone down my anger and stop being so bigoted and judgmental. I can't possibly know how you see things and will stop thinking I know everything you all think.

-Johnnyh


Ganondox
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30 Nov 2016, 7:14 pm

johnnyh wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
Such as stress or anxiety during pregnancy?


No, I mean social factors after birth. Stress and anxiety during pregnancy results in biological factors.


Why is there a 50/50 chance of autism from Fragile X? It is obviously increased in chances from a syndrome.


Fragile X is a genetic disorder, so I don't see what your point is.


So what are the enviromental factors that cause one twin to be neurotypical but another to be autistic?


There are too many different factors to pinpoint specific one, but as I said before, a lot of the factors are probably actually social.


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Ganondox
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30 Nov 2016, 7:17 pm

johnnyh wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
Such as stress or anxiety during pregnancy?


No, I mean social factors after birth. Stress and anxiety during pregnancy results in biological factors.


Why is there a 50/50 chance of autism from Fragile X? It is obviously increased in chances from a syndrome.


Fragile X is a genetic disorder, so I don't see what your point is.


If a genetic disorder that causes suffering increases the chance of autism, doesn't that make autism a disease?
Why isn't autism, which is supposedly so good and not a disorder, not caused by healthy eating or exercise then?


No. That's straight idiot logic. That's like saying because albinism causes white hair and it causes suffering (due to light sensitivity impairing vision), having white hair is inherently a disease. Many people though have white hair and aren't suffering at all. The next sentence is even stupider, so I'll just link this: Image


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