Asperger Syndrome and Culture?

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I lived in the United States for a number of years and I can tell you that life as an autistic in the U.S., especially if you are an Asian autistic, is no better than life as an autistic in Singapore. The talk of Western individualism is really bogus in my opinion. Everyone conforms to certain norms and people who do not conform are quite literally crunched up. But that was the U.S. Maybe Australia is different, if you are white that is.

I lived in the United States for a number of years and I can tell you that life as an autistic in the U.S., especially if you are an Asian autistic, is no better than life as an autistic in Singapore. The talk of Western individualism is really bogus in my opinion. Everyone conforms to certain norms and people who do not conform are quite literally crunched up. But that was the U.S. Maybe Australia is different, if you are white that is.

Hi Radiohead, I am Singaporean as well.

I do agree that West and east do have advantages and disadvantages for people with ASDs. The problem in Singapore is that there is no ASD group just like you said, have people of subcultures in groups, geeks, punk.etc.

But my friends and I have created one such group recently. you can PM me to for more info.

Wow there are more Singaporean on this "planet" than I thought...

I'm American, but I find a lot of conformity, an emphasis on not rocking the boat, etc. There's a lot of lip-service paid to noconformity (just so long as it's the same kind of nonconformity as all the other nonconformists, of course), but it...

Wellllll, it does matter when it's all theoretical. I've been able to be totally open with everyone about the fact that I have Asperger's Syndrome. But (there's always a but), I have to hide all my symptoms. Talk about insane.

It's not shameful to say that I have a disability that keeps me from being completely proficient with social skills. It is shameful to have poor social skills.

There's a big emphasis on being an individual, but when it comes right down to it, everyone tries to bring you back into line if you actually believe that they mean what they say.

Why? Ten minutes glance at world history should be enough to disabuse anyone of that idea. Different cultures encourage different behaviour. Some are better and some are worse, unless one does not count human decency as important.

The same in my country (in Southern Europe) - adults diagnosed with AS usually don't work, live with their parents and (while their parents are at work) spend the day in institutions for mentally disabled people.

My culture is not "more reserved, more detail-oriented, emotionally distant etc" (much the opposite); however, perhaps is more tolerant for "excentricity" and intellectualism.

I think (and I am sure there have been related threads) that being a foreigner can remove many expectations, so it is much, much easier to function socially as a foreigner with Asperger's than as a local. I find things most difficult when I am within the culture that people expect I am from, where my behaviour must be most divergent from expectation.

I have difficulty imagining how this would work in a multi-ethnic society like Singapore, or to a lesser extent Malaysia. Everyone probably has an accurate enough idea of how Chinese people act and react, so being Chinese is not foreign and is not a mask for Asperger's.

It does happen in Polytechnic and the friends can just write bad stuff about you if they dun like you somewhat like a gang of wolves.

Glad to know that I am not the only Singaporean here too. Apparently that Strait's Times article has brought Aspie Singaporeans to this place. But I hope they can find my Aspie forum among all the chatter.

But StuartN, do note that the local Singaporean Chinese and the Mainlanders from Mainland China have a very different mindset.

Spoken like a true (white) westerner.

Radiohead:

I think this is a very interesting subject you have raised. I've worked closely with many Asians from Taiwan, Japan, China, Korea and other east Asian countries and I have noticed that the ethnic Chinese at least, do tend to be very indirect...or at least hesitant, in some of their communications.

I am also all too familiar with the pressure on many individuals from these cultures to be successful conformist and "normal" in life. However I believe that is starting to change in the younger generations. I recently saw a documentary on a school in China for autistic children, and while Japan still has unfortunately high suicide rates, there are far more individuals acknowledging this problem and pushing for a change in the perceptions of society on issue such as depression and the likes. I think the younger Japanese generations are very far removed from that of their grandparents, or even parents, and much artistic and technological creativity has come out of Japan and South Korea these past few years.

Of all of the Asians I have worked with, I have yet to meet one who did not embrace the "liberal" aspects of western culture. But then again, perhaps the ones who don't simply don't come to the US.

I don't believe Asian culture stems from inherentness though. There are many Chinese Americans who's families immigrated in the 1800's, and Japanese Americans who's families have also been here for quite some time, and they are 100% western.

Sir (or Ma'am) do not be so apologetic. Everyone thinks his own culture is either better or more natural. It is the nature of culture to produce such biases. Whatever biases you have, you are in good company.

ruveyn

Heard that one a lot and it always seemed not to be true for me. I've always or at least since I learned about them preferred European, Latin, Australian, and even some tribal cultures(especially the one whose name I forgot in the Amazon who were so peaceful they didn't even have a word for "murder") to American culture. Several things such as less sexual repression, less social and political apathy, more caring, and oddly enough more individual freedom*. As a teenager I often contemplated running away from home, stowing away, and living in another country.

So we all start as ethnocentric because at first one's own culture is the only one they know but with education they might discover another culture that fits their individual values, beliefs, and preferences even more closely.

*I say more individual freedom, because frankly I find the whole idea of America as individualist to be a complete fabrication. America has a distorted individualism, an individualism defined by consumption and an unending drive to make more and more money and get higher and higher positions for the sake of showing off. Everyone is still expected to hold the same values and attitudes, such as the social expectation of "trying to keep up with the Jones'" There's nothing individualist about trying to be better than your neighbor. You're still letting your neighbor dictate your behavior.

"Western Individualism" is better termed "narcissism". Narcissists only think they love themselves, they really love their image. In America if you're not trying to show off all the time people think you're a freak.

There is also a great deal of workplace conformity in America, far beyond what you'd see in Europe. People get fired for things they do outside the workplace. On top of that there seems to be a trickling factor. Ever notice how adults as they get older tend to start dressing work-appropriate even when they're not at work?

Individualism is also used as a convenient political excuse to avoid economic regulation, even though some regulation could help individualism by giving the average person more job opportunities, allowing for more freedom in lifestyle choices, or a higher wage to spend on themselves.

EDIT: Good example of how language reveals the way our culture has made individualism all about "image" and not about the real "self". Take the phrase "pride your appearance". When people use that phrase what they actually mean is "conforming to the social norms about what makes a good appearance". The implication is a cultural assumption that everyone must agree on what the correct image is and therefore a person who doesn't measure up to that image must not be taking pride in it. This assumption when unearthed and examined fails logic. A person could have their own personal ideal of beauty and only appear as though they do not take pride in it to someone who has another idea of beauty.

I've concluded cultural values are not relative, nor is any one culture automatically right. To determine whether a cultural norm, more, taboo, or otherwise rule is correct it has to be analyzed for how it came about and hidden implications to see if it holds up to logic and reason.

Last edited by DGuru on 10 Nov 2010, 8:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

'Good Day Sunshine' by The Beatles can be our theme song.

Just in terms of overcoming discrimination, or including aspects of independent living such as public transport?