Brother and Mother with Asperger's?

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Hi Everyone,
I'm new here and am seeking help in coping with my mother. All my life I thought she just did not care for me very much, but knew she loved me. My brother, who is diagnosed with severe ADHD and was difficult to live with, appears to really have Asperger's (according to his wife) and it also appears, according to the same woman, who is a doctor, that my mother has Asperger's as well. This would explain a lot, but how do I know for sure? What symptoms should I look for to diagnose her? I can't approach her with this theory. Any advice would be helpful. I would appreciate help in learning the best way to handle my mother and brother as well. Thank you.

Reading on this forum helps a lot.

Personal experiences?

Bad eye contact
inability to read social cues
shockingly bad behavior on occasion
can be quick to anger
very likely to drink in social situations
would rather be doing something with someone rather than just talk to them
eats the same thing every day
tends to collect things
romantic obsessions
very "walking on eggshells" for the NT
very rigid routines --they will only do things like go to the movies or shopping, but maybe not both
fixated on things--oriental rugs/records/ a particular person/movie posters
uncomfortable with emotional closeness (can't call them at work to say, "I love you.")
odd ideas about social norms. ("My friends wouldn't do that"--and it's something normal.)
needs a lot of down time
rocking
finger or thumb peeling
very OCD
tends to lecture
good analytical skills
perfectionist
long-term memory issues
bad with financial issues if left to themselves
can interpret language very literally, particularly under stress
can be bad with long-term relationships
strong tendencies towards lying, defensiveness and blaming
sesonry issues: light, clothing, smells
trouble reading faces, including dogs


Hope that helps. There is more, but that is what I have observed.

Thank you, Poppyx, for all of your time and assistance! This list is incredibly helpful, and many of the items sure do sound like my mother, but more so like my brother. Perhaps my brother has Asperger's to a stronger degree.

Any advice on how I can avoid getting my mother upset all the time? She seems to pick on everything I do, as well. Nothing ever pleases her.

I moved back in with my parents 2 years ago to help them out, and at times my mother makes living here difficult.

Please do ignore poppyx. He is one of those poeple who thinks that everything bad can be attributed to asperger's syndrome.

While some of the things on his list may be indicative of some people with AS (Asperger's Syndrome). I can assure you that the following have nothing to do with asperger's syndrome:
shockingly bad behavior on occasion
can be quick to anger
very likely to drink in social situations
romantic obsessions
very "walking on eggshells" for the NT
very OCD
long-term memory issues
bad with financial issues if left to themselves
strong tendencies towards lying, defensiveness and blaming

From my experience, these behaviors are far more common amongst normal people. I have met many abusive, immature, antisocial normal people, most notably my own mother. These traits are indicative of somebody who lacks the morals or maturity to act appropriately. And this problem can happen both with normal people, and those with asperger's syndrome. Being immature and having asperger's syndrome are not the same thing.

For example, my own father is where I inherit my AS from, and he is perhaps the kindest, calmest, most patient, well behaved person I know. So, to say that Asperger's syndrome makes your quick to anger is absolutely ridiculous. There may be some people with Asperger's Syndrome who are quick to anger, but definitely not all of them, and it has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they have Asperger's Syndrome.

That being said, to the original post, try reading around the forums, and perhaps check out a book from the library. There is one called 'The complete guide to asperger's syndrome' which may be fairly useful. If you are looking for information sooner, then try the wikipedia link here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asperger_syndrome

It isn't perfect, but it is close.

There is a woman's forum with some threads about AS in women. You might want to read through some of that. AS is often missed in women and girls because it can look different than it does in men and boys, much like ADHD used to be. Most research has concentrated on boys with little work on females or adults of either gender.

Just because your sister in law is a doctor doesn't mean she's qualified to properly diagnose. She may be absolutely correct, and may be better at making that kind of observation because of her gifts and medical training than most people but a psychologist or psychiatrist would be the best person to make a diagnosis. There are other things that can look a lot like AS, but are treated differently. There are also tests that should be done.

If your mom isn't open to hearing about this, it may be best to just educate yourself and try to understand what it's like for people with AS. You might be able to adjust some of yor behaviors around her in a way that will be helpful to her and improve your relationship with her. Even if she's never willing to consider a diagnosis because of some percieved stigma, you might still be able to help.

I didn't get my diagnosis f ADHD until I was in my mid forties. All my life I knew something was different about me and I wasn't always treated wellt. Sometimes I felt I had to deny being different to defend myself, as if my denial would make people treat me better. Your mom may feel that way too. At the time I was diagnosed I was surrounded by caring understanding people, which made me very comfortable accepting a diagnosis and accepting help. If you can find ways to show your mom you care, and can encourage other people to do that too, not in a patronizing way but in a kind way, she may soften up a bit and consider at least making some changes.

Thank you for clarifying that Tracker....I really get annoyed when people try to box up symptoms of Aspergers....especially when most of them are wrong!
I am really offended when people say that Aspies are liars. One of the reasons we sometimes offend people is because we are too honest...we have to learn how to lie and by this I mean "white lies" to protect others feelings.

O.k....I would like to challenge you on that--

I don't have any of the listed symptoms, nor do any of my close friends or family, with the exception of one person I know who has narcissistic personality disorder and the aspie I know.

I didn't say they had to have all the symptoms, or that NTs don't have some of them, too.

The list put together, though?

It's AS--and it's not from me. It's from Marshak and Rudy Simone, experts in AS.

If you don't like it, go argue with them.

Read as many books as you can on the subject, and find a therapist for YOU who knows about AS.

A therapist can be very very helpful and validating. I started to feel sane again after one session talking about my aspie.

And, "Yes, there are some wonderful aspies", but you should note the poster above has AS, so of course he likes his AS father--an NT child might not have!

I don't know the author, is she a clinical psych or a doctor? When I looked her up (here: http://www.jkp.com/catalogue/author/1977 ) it just said this:

"Rudy Simone is an Aspergirl, writer and AS consultant who lives in the San Francisco Bay Area."

what's an AS consultant precisely?

Eldest son couldn't lie at all until recently. He just couldn't get his head around the concept of making up an alternate reality and trying to convince someone it was true. He'd refuse to speak if he was asked if he'd done something wrong. "Who ate the last cookie" Not me! Not Me! Silence, would come the three responses. One of them did but only two of them could lie about it. One of those liars is also an Aspie and the other one was dx'd as PDD-NOS but now we're not sure. Now that Eldst Son has hit puberty he has been lying a blue streak, and mostly doing it badly. At least he's made that cognitive leap so something new is working in his brain that didn't before.

I think an inability to lie can be part of some people's AS but that it isn't necessarily permanent. I think it was somehow tied to his extreme literal thinking.

If you've met one Aspie, you've met one Aspie.

I don't know but I think it's a good article. I've read several books by well qualified experts and spent many hours talking to our psyches and the article sums up what I've learned very well with accuracy and respect. I take Wiki with a grain of salt because not all the sources are equally good, but I think that particular article is right on.

That's not an exhaustive list--and you're right, "Some aspies lie because they have to tell white lies to survive."

Let's add another trait, "Defensiveness"

Basically, what I meant was, "Pick several of these traits. Have substantial problems with social or occupational functioning. (Not all of these traits--just some)"

Probably an aspie or an NT with a personality disorder.

Is that better?

that list of traits will describe the person they are based on, but since autism is a spectrum disorder, the list may be very different for another autistic. individual specific traits are not good as a diagnostic tool, you need to use broader views, therefore its best to go by the diagnostic criteria. that wiki article is pretty good, and you can find a breakdown of the diagnostic criteria at the CDC website at http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/hcp-dsm.html

lying is not a diagnostic criteria for any form of asd. it is however a human action, so some aspies will do it just like some NTs will.

not everything an aspie does is because of their asd. sometimes its just who they are. i look at it like those transparent projectors they used to use in school. the autism is just another overlay that adds to the whole picture, it isnt the entire person.

My oldest son is bi polar and his first instinct is to lie...its almost like he was born that way. He is very hard for me to understand, I love him very much but it is very hurtful that he lies to me so much. My two aspies and me are honest as Abe . The few times my teenage Aspie has tried to lie to me she always breaks down and tells the truth. My 7 year old aspie son will always quickly admit what he did. We have a serious guilt complex. As far as the defensiveness, it is hard for an aspie to take criticism. Just like many other things takes practice to learn how separate constructive criticism and attacks. In that respect its how you go about leveling criticism at an Aspie. I think it was really hard for me when I got older and went out into the work force because making little mistakes to me felt as though Id done something horrible and Id loose it, crying uncontrollably (meltdown).
Another big problem I have is that sometimes people think that Im yelling at, and angry with them when Im only excited about something. I have had this problem for a long time and after I was diagnosed I could understand and explain it to others. So now people who know me understand that I am not angry with them I am either very passionate or very excited. Sometimes what you perceive in someone is not the way it was intended. Just like I dont always understand some NT behavior, they dont understand mine. Its hard when you dont know that what others are perceiving is incorrect unless someone is literal about it....if that makes sense? Now that I know I have Asperger's I dont feel so embarrassed to ask "what does that mean?" or "why do you do that?".
I do agree that there are a lot of people who have disorders, be they autism or a mental illness, who use it as an excuse to be a jerk. That said, sometimes appearing as a jerk, also may not be intentional. I think if we all work harder at understanding each other and not blaming (each other or our disorders) the better off we would all be.
I work very hard at understanding my oldest son but then there are things that I hold him accountable for. Some of the bad things he does may be a caused by his illness (he also is a drug addict) but its not an excuse.
Its weeding out what you can control and what you cant on your side and what you should understand and where to put your foot down on the other side that becomes difficult.

I am sorry but I don't know where you are getting your information from. If I go to Rudy Simone's Website, then I find this list of traits:

http://www.help4aspergers.com/pb/wp_4a3 ... 112c8.html

I notice that this list doesn't include things like drinking, quick to anger, or poor with money.

I am not saying that everybody with AS is perfect. There may indeed be some difficulties with normal people and those with asperger's syndrome seeing eye to eye. This can result in confusion, and misunderstanding. It is therefore the job of both parties to spend some time getting to know and understand the other person. But to say that asperger's syndrome is likely to make you quick to anger, poor with money, or anything else is nothing more then a crock. Asperger's Syndrome does not make you immature, selfish, or amoral. If you happen to know somebody who is selfish, immature, and amoral then it has nothing to do with whether or not they also have asperger's syndrome.

No. The "drinking, quick to anger and poor with money" are in her book and Marshak's.